A Free subscribed Discussion List
                   on web marketing and promotion
                       Bogdan Fiedur,  Publisher
                      David Bredeweg, Moderator
                          Vol 1, #31, September 28, 1998

Topics in this issue:
Sponsor Info:                             AdPlan
Press Release:                           Internet Marketing Classes
AdTrax Anwer                         "Pete Sral of AdTrax Software"
Last of alphabet        :       (WILL WARD)
Search Engine Nightmare            "Anil Nath" <>
Who is N-Bill                    
                                                    Michael Cano
Marketing Tools                         IOManger
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Subject:          Norm's AdTrax Question
From:             "Pete Sral of AdTrax Software" <>

AdTrax does not automatically repost ads.  However, with the
suggestions I received from "Norm" <> I will be
working on such a feature.  Version 1 is the first step: move away
from a paper based tracking system to a computerized system.  Next we
will integrate into the internet and have it repost ads.  However, the
current price of AdTrax is only $19.99 with the new release
(hopefully, within the next 6 months)... it will increase.  This is a
good time to get a foot in the door before the price is increased.  We
have a life-time free upgrade option and if you are willing to invest
in our product we will invest in your success by offering you a better
product.  Norm, thank you for your great input!  I would like to thank
the entire AdLand family for all their responses... keep it up I love
to hear from you!

Sincerely, Pete Sral
Subject:          Last of alphabet
From:    (WILL WARD)

Hi gang,
It's been awhile since we last posted,but we've been busy!!! Our
problem is  our Business name begins with 'W' which is near the end of
the alphabet.  We have already registered our Domain names with
InterNIC. How do we get recognized when we are at the end of the

Thank You,
Will & Lorene Ward
"We give away a Free Vacation Every Single Day! 
To register for todays drawing, visit

(Moderator's 02) It's not your domain name necessarily that you use
to list with search engines, which is what you seem to be asking. It
is the keywords that you use which makes your sight relevant. One
could be Webtv. Believe me, even if you had started with a double AA
you would not come up in the first 20 unless you had a very relevant
keyword that outranked others in your keyword(s) choice.
Follow the keys given on some of the search engine web sites to
optimize it and give it the highest relevancy possible. For some
choices on these website, go to
Subject:        search Engine Nghtmare...for the new and old alike.
From:             "Anil Nath" <>

Hello all,

Please bear with my phraseology, I am 3 months old on the net, but
mature with computers!

I wonder where this cat and mouse game that major search engines are
playing with the web masters, is going to lead. We all know the
rationale behind the secrecy and stuck-up attitude, but this is goes
against the very spirit of the Internet. This is getting to be like
some kind of bureaucratic red tape.  I really wonder if the search
engines with all their complicated listing and position criteria are,
achieving what the are supposed to be striving for.

I would like to put forth certain arguments:

This closed door attitude is only going to lead us away from authentic
content and listing in.  If the the criteria  were transparent like
everything else on the net, web masters would not have to resort to
desperate and sometimes unethical methods to facilitate better

Why should one not submit  number of times? Web sites are continually
changing page and meta content which puts its status in new light as
far as listing goes. On the contrary, search engines should demand,
encourage and facilitate such re-submissions.  I for one, only
discovered fully the importance and proper usage of meta tags after I
had submitted my URL to all the major search engines at least twice!!!
So much for starting on the right foot. I am still suffering the after
effects of this very predictable action. The search engines that list
me today reflect my meta tags that are now almost totally revamped.
This is bound to happen during the initial tuning process. Since the
time taken to get listed is in weeks, one tends to shoot the
submission a little too prematurely maybe.

Every one should have the right to be listed and rated on face value
(meta and page content) and be awarded the automatically generated
position for a particular keyword. This trend of key words reservation
in not looking healthy and goes against the very  foundation  of
search engines. If this trend catches on, it won't be long before
we'll call search engines, Yellow Pages. Paid key word searches would
still make some kind of sense in directories, but not for "spider
crawling robot secret agents" working round the clock to explore and
seek URLs.

I think the time has come to legislate with a view to standardise the
criteria and front door, as far as listing goes. The dos and don'ts
should be up front and penalties should be implemented against
webmasters trying to spam listings. I can't understand why an
attempted re-listing of a URL should create such a hue and cry? Many
webmasters like in my case have to change the content  and meta tags
so drastically like I did that resubmission is often warranted. Sure
some search engines have made provisions for this, but why not just a
re-list. I am sure lack of technology could not be the problem. Could
it be that info tech has gone so far that plain simple reasoning has
got lost some where. It's going to take more than a robot to find it!!
Another Y2k problem?

Hope this did not sound like a drone, but this issue has really got to

Wishing you all well,
Anil Nath
Webmaster (I think)
MN Editorial & Consultancy Services

(Moderator's 02) Not to be to sarcastic Anil, but welcome to the web.
You are not alone. After three years I have not been able to get much
nigher than 30 on a few with only a few key words. What comes up
first every time is my domain names, because they are unique. But
anyone who knows the name, won't need the search engine, just type it
in the URL window. So, because it is so time consuming I have gone on
to other important things and then later will work on my
optimiazation again, hoping to get higher with new submissions.
I would be interested in others views on this as well.
I have a solution, I'm sure will work, very even, that is to simply
rotate the sites, say first 25, everytime the keyword is used. If
there are 100 listings, you will be in the top 25 once every four
uses of the keyword. Just a suggestion.
Subj:   Who is N-Bill
From: (Michael Cano)

Response to:

Responding to your post on Adland August 31, 1998. You informed us of
your problem with the N-Bill.

Your posting prompted me to review my credit card statements
immediately. I too have been bit by the N-Bill charge.

Here is what I have found out Who is N-Bill.
    They are a billing Processing Center for multiple business:
        1. Internet
        2. Cable
        3. ATM debit cards
        4. All major Credit Cards

Name & Location:

Online Billing Service
2620 South Maryland Parkway, Suite 563
Las Vegas, Nevada 89109-1673

Customer Service Telephone: 1-800-918-8400
Fax: 1-800-535-9120

After several days of calling and their hang-ups, I finally got
through to them and spoke to someone but they would not give me their
name. however, they claimed my billing was for a porno web-site
subsription which I refuted and disgree with them.

The gal I spoke to advised me FAX copies of my credit card statements
and they will review and credit the charges.

Hope this information helps you, you may want to do the same.
>From someone that cares.
(M 02 Thanks Michael, very interesting.)
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Let's hear from you......

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