A Free subscribed Discussion List
                           of  25,180 subscribers
                     on web marketing and promotion
               supported by AdlandPro World's Classifieds
                        Bogdan Fiedur,  Publisher
                                      contact at
                      Vol. 1 issue #323  Dec, 14, 2002

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Topics in this issue:

Sponsor Message
Word from Publisher
1.Tired of hype Yipe!

C o n t i n u i n g   D i s c u s s i o n s (2)

1.From Very Start
~Mike Fisher
~Amalia Sotiriadou
~John Olson
~Katheryn Labosky
~Arthur  Velasco
~Claire Solt
~Pete Carr
~Dolores G. Wix
~William Jaroske

2.GMT Auto Responder
~Cathy Wagner
~Saundra E. Jackson

N e w     P o s t s  (2)

1.Kathy Welch
~New to internet

2.Claire Solt

Site Review Requests   (1)

1.William Nabaza

Site Review Responses   (2)

1.John Olson

2.Tom Falco

G u e s t   A r t i c l e    (0)

Joke of the Day

================== Word from publisher ====================

Greetings All

Welcome  270 new subscribers who joined list since last mailing.

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=================Tired of hype Yipe!=====================
From:Audra Gehrke

Hi Bogdan and Everyone,

Bogdan, FYI, I'm now ranked in the
100s out of 10,000 affiliates for you!!

You have no idea how excited I am about this.
I've been with Adlandpro almost from the very
beginning of my adventure and your the Only one
I'm with right now. Just goes to show others
that free can be very helpful if you continue
to move forward.

It absolutely amazes me what I've done with this
computer in less than 4 years and you are partly
to blame for that Bogdan.:) Thank You for continuing
to support and pay me on time. If your classifieds
aren't number 1 in everyone's book, they don't
know what they are missing!

For Rebecca and everyone else who sits on their
computers and wonders why they aren't getting rich
quick over doesn't happen, period.

* Don't listen to the "Gurus", you will go broke!

* Make your Own decisions, it's Your business!

* If you don't have any free money to spend to
get started then you can start for free, but don't
in anyway think free will get you rich because you
get what you pay for!

* If you have questions then ask them. Don't think
any question is dumb, the only dumb question is the
one you don't ask. Ask and you shall receive!

* Don't expect a free ride. We had to work our butts
off to get where we are and you shouldn't expect
anything more or less.

Put your business in a reality aspect when planning.
Think of it as a outside business and you need
1,000s of dollars to get started. Think of being there
at a certain time and the traffic you have to fight
to get there. Think of how you aren't going to be there
when your kids get home from school and your spouse
from work. Think of the time you will have to be
away for your outside business and the money your
going to need to just get started, let alone run it.

Now which business would you rather work towards?

If you look at it in a Reality aspect, you'll see
that it's a lot cheaper and you Honestly can get
started for free on here. I know, I did it and now
I teach others how they can do it.

How I wish I would have saved my very first ugly
website just to show you that you learn and grow
as you go. You just have to keep moving forward
and keep reaching for your dreams because you Can
make them come true. It's all up to you. No one
else can do it for you. It's all about You. What
do You really want?

Are you really ready to take the plunge?

It is a lot of work I won't kid you, but if you
stick to it daily, you will look back and see
how much you have learned and grown, then you will
feel this great sense of accomplishment come
over you, and that's when you will Never look back.

The internet opened up many doors for many many
people. There's plenty of room on here for All of
us. I know it's hard when your new but it does
get better and easier as you go. If you really want it
bad enough then you will find a way to get it. Don't
depend on anyone for support or money, depend on
You only, and You will make it happen for You.

Bogdan, I apologise for making this so long. It was
supposed to be a short reply but I know what the new
people online are feeling and I really feel for them.
I'll Never forget how it was for me and that's why I
now help others. Hype is all we see on here and I'm
so tired of it all. Do people really believe they
will make money without lifting a finger? I know
they do otherwise they wouldn't be using those hyped
up ads. I'm so glad I never fell for those when I
was new but I always believed we get what we worked

Believe in yourself and you can have everything
you've ever wanted. This is your life, not anyone
else's. Go after what you want in your life and
you can get it. You really can have it all but
first, you have to work for it and do it honestly.

All the Best,

Ecommerce Resources Ezine


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===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.1)=============
From:Mike Fisher
Subject:From Very Start

Hi Lawrence and fellow Adlanders,your plight takes me back to my early
days on the net and the shear frustration and heartache associated with
internet marketing.Lawrence there are some excellent replies to your
predicament in the same issue of the Digest that your letter shared,read
them and take heart.Choose your options carefully and avoid hype at all
costs.There is no need to waste hundreds of dollars on various programs as
I did in the early days,find one that suits your style and stick with
it.Don't expect to get rich quick it will not happen,but perseverance and
hard work will bring you results.Most importantly find good upline support
this is essential and should be put above all else.I could go on and
on,but because I have achieved modest success,I would rather offer my help
to you in what ever way I can.I would be glad to advise you and share my
experiences with you.Write me about the program you are in and lets see
where we go from there.I'm sure you will receive help from other Adlanders
as well.
    kind regards Mike Fisher



===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.2)=============
From:Amalia Sotiriadou
Subject:From Very Start

Dear Lawrence,

I was just going to skip on to the next post, but I could not leave your
plea for help unanswered. Teaching people how to become successful on the
net with  minimum investment is my business, after all. Hop on over to if it's not too much trouble and see
how we can help you. And no, it's NOT another opportunity. This is serious
learning - IF you want to be a serious learner!



===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.3)=============
From:John Olson
Subject:From Very Start


I welcome you to the world of online business. And I understand that losing your
job the Friday before Thanksgiving is hard and that you need to get something
going to take care of your family. And I do wish you all the best.

But Please do one thing for me and for yourself. Find another REAL Job to take
care of things while you build whatever it is you are building online. Unless
you have some kind of Golden Parachute from your old job, or a Lot in the old
savings account you can afford to risk, get a REAL Job to keep food on the

Building a business online, as with building a business anywhere, takes time. Do
you really want to gamble with your families future by not having something to
pay the bills with while your online business gets going?

And one more thing, you posted this to the Digest and told us to E-mail you with
help or to check out the business you are building, but you didn't give us
anything but the fact that you have an ad on Adland somewhere. If you want help,
you have to make it easier for us to help. At least you could have told us what
business or ad to look for.

Good Luck to you and your family, but take my advice and get another job, any
job, just so you have something coming in while you build an online business. No
matter what any Website tells you or sells you, nothing happens over night. It
all takes time.

Take care,

John Olson

It's Your Money. It's Your Time.


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.4)=============
From:Katheryn Labosky
Subject:From Very Start

Hello Lawrence.  Thought I'd jump in here and try to perhaps
help you somewhat.  I have been in your situation, Lawrence,
as I was a high-profile executive at a college for
sixteen years, before I was literally forced by my life's
circumstances (I am the single mother of quite a few
kids, and the sole caretaker of my terminally ill younger
brother to resign and try to support all my many dependents
from a business of my own, as I needed the flexibility.

I now have a for the most part, successful online venture,
and no, it is not a "program" or affiliate venture.  I do
promote my own goods and services successfully, but it did
and still does, take a lot of work, Lawrence, and I know
things now that I didn't realize, like you, in the beginning.

For starters, most successful businesses take almost 3-5
years to establish.  This is fact.  Mine is almost three
years old now, and I can definitely see the difference, as
you will, too, if you take the time to promote it and
stick with one legitimate program or sale of goods and
services.  I still work almost 50 hrs. per week, but in
the beginning was putting in about 60-70 per week.  It
takes this kind of commitment.

Secondly, only 3-5% of new businesses, either online or
offline succeed beyond their first year, due to the lack
of a good understanding of the commitment issue and also
a lack of a good business plan and sound business
principles (if you want to go into what sound business
principles are, just email me and I'll gladly respond).

Thirdly, all advertising needs to be tracked.  If you're
not tracking your advertising, you are literally throwing
money away.  If your website does not have tracking, it is
worthless to you as well.

Fourth, good advertising doesn't have to cost anything,
other than time.  Free advertising works just as well as
paid advertising, if you do it consistently and religiously.
I do place almost 200 free ads per week in locations that
have been proven to be "responders", ( I know others do not
think free ads work, but they do), but again, all this
takes an enormous amount of time and commitment.

I do publish an ezine devoted to those struggling on the
net today, Lawrence, called "The Reluctant Entrepreneur"
(as this is what I am), and will subscribe you if you
so choose.  It has only four ads (max) per issue, as this
is not its mission.  Its mission is to answer questions
and supply info provided by my own research into commonly
asked questions by "net newbies" such as yourself.  It is
also only published monthly, so you will not have to
contend with unwanted multiple appearances in your mailbox.

Again, if you want to talk, just email or call.  I would
be glad to provide the support you are seeking, as this
is something I did not find much of myself on the net, and
do my best now to help others achieve success.

Katheryn Labosky
"The Reluctant Entrepreneur"

KLR Marketing Services/Written Solutions



===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.5)=============
From:Arthur  Velasco
Subject:From Very Start

Hey Lawrence, my name is Arthur Velasco I understand your situation and
circumstances. First of all, you've reached possibly the best source of
help that you can imagine.Not myself,personally, but on behalf of all
netmarketers, you will be inundated with all the answers to these problems
very shortly.              All these netmarketers offer a helping hand, as
I have personally witnessed,and will guide you to the most effective means
and will provide you with all available resources to be able to market
whatever it is that you may want to sell or information you may want to
provide.I have been on the net as a marketer for only 4 months and have
found a few sources to get me going.I don't know what you're selling and
where you're advertising,but I can tell you one thing,if you don't have
any traffic to your site, you need to get some right away.Adlandpro can
provide you with these at a very affordable price and help you get your
site noticed thru their advertising(FREE).I've had excellent responses
thru their avenues. All the businesses advertising here are very
professional people and can provide you with other resources @ free or
very low prices.Just look thru the Adlandpro resources first and if you
still need some info, contact me.

Arthur  Velasco

--------------------------------------------------------------------              Leads are the most
vital part of any business online or offline.You can find your own
resources here.


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.6)=============
From:Claire Solt
Subject:From Very Start

First I suggest that you get a part-time job to take some of the pressure
off you and your family. A telemarketing job is perfect, because it will
teach you phone skills you will need.

It is possible to build your business with free advertising, at first. It
takes more work and it will go slowly, but it is possible. I did it that
way, and fourteen months later I have 703 in my downline.

These free programs were tested and endorsed by Club Midas. They produce
reliable results. Please remember that, at last count, it takes 4000 hits
to get a free signup. So make that your weekly goal. (make this
your start page)

Here are a couple of controlled safelists where you earn the right to send
your ads out:

You will need to have an FFA page and mail the leads you get from it every

Use click-through traffic generating programs sparingly. Half an hour a
day is plenty. After you have downlines in these programs you may be able
to accumulate enough clicks to matter, but not by yourself. I've seen
people run up 10,000 hits using these without a single sign-up. They get

Above all, be realistic about the time and effort it will take.

Claire Solt


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.7)=============
From:Pete Carr
Subject:From Very Start

Lawrence, you did not mention what your site is, or the URL. If I read
that right, you started your site 10 days ago, and it is not doing what
you think it should? Why do I get the feeling you've bought into the
Internet Treasure Chest? We've been online since 1998, and just now into
the top 100K web sites worldwide, according to Alexa and Jupitermedia.
Without knowing the focus of your site, it would be impossible to give any
advise. Also, make a signature file, or post your web site URL on every
email and message you send to every list.

Pete Carr




===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.8)=============
From:Dolores G. Wix
Subject:From Very Start

In response to your post, Laurence, I can relate to what you're going
through.  Last December I was laid off and decided to start my own
e-publishing business.  I didn't have a lot of money either and ended up
very disappointed because I didn't know who to listen to.

My husband and I learned the hard way that the only way to be successful
is by associating with others who have been successful on-line.  Here are
two guys who are successful on-line and who tell it like it is:  Jim
Daniels (;
and Terry Dean (  You will have to pay for their
"wisdom" which they have learned the hard way but in the long run, it will
save you a lot of trial and error and heartache. Some information you can
get off their web sites for free from articles and ebooks they have

Also, to help you identify legitimate business opportunities, check out
Online Scam Reports ( and Scam
Slam! (

I wish you the greatest success in whatever business you decide to do.

Most respectfully,

Dolores G. Wix


Author, How to Survive and Thrive After a Layoff
Fertile Ground Publishing - "Where Words Blossom" (SM)


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.9)=============
Subject:From Very Start

Hi Lawrence

My suggestion would be to go back to where you was working. and count your
$250.00 as a warning, I have over $15,000.00 invested and have yet to
produce one penny.

I try to follow every thing I am told but there is always something to buy
to make it work for sure, you buy it but it still won't work, I join
safelists and send out hundreds of ad's nothing.

I notified one company I belong to I wanted to quit after five years of
trying, so they are going to offer help which they did this week so we will
see how it goes, I do not have any answers and neither does Adland Pro. I
have been with them for years and the info I received from them has not
done anything either.

Best of Luck



===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.10)=============
From:William Jaroske
Subject:From Very Start

Lawrence, Mark,

The first thing you need to do is shop around for a home business
opportunity. There are allot of them that will be very enticing. Look for
value and low cost investment. I think you should read my last post about
hype. Then do some comparing on what is best for you.

I also will tell you allot of the free sign ups are mostly garbage.Bottom
line, Look before you leap. Beware Of affiliates that promote mass email
marketing known as email blasting and other spamming tactics. It could
leave a bad taste in your mouth for a long time.

William Jaroske



===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (2.1)=============
From:Cathy Wagner
Subject:GMT Auto Responder

Hi John,

Most free autoresponders are free because they include ads at the very bottom of
your message or the top, sometimes both. My guess with GMT is they must be
charging for that ad space and are willing to share a little of what they earn
with you.

Be aware. It will take time to develop an autoresponder series and a large list
of people who want to receive it. GMT's payment to you is probably very small;
be sure to see if there is a minimum payout and if that amount is a realistic
number based on what they pay you (paying you 1c per message sent with a minimum
payout of $100 will take a very long time indeed!) I have used a free
autoresponder that promised to pay you 25c for every free member you referred
with a minimum payout of $25; they went out of business long before I referred
my 1000 free members. Be sure to have your autoresponder series backed up - not
just on your pc, but on a disk, too.

Have a Profitable Day,

Cathy Wagner

ONE STOP Internet Business Services
If you can get it for FREE, we'll show you where!
If you HAVE to pay, use our recommendations to
get the MOST for your money!


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (2.2)=============
From:Saundra E. Jackson
Subject:GMT Auto Responder

You ask How can any company afford to pay you especially when you join for
free. How can they expect
to stay in business for very long?

They can not.  Only in the beginning.  Pretty soon you will start to
receive notification that your free trial period has run out and in order
to continue with the program you must upgrade or loss your position and
downline. or something to the sort.

Just a way to draw you in.  If you really thought about it someone would
have to pay something sooner or later or the whole thing would fall apart.
Sooner rather than later.

You get out what you put in. Take a break on me an play golf.  Win some

Saundra E. Jackson

Play golf online
Earn Free Groceries.


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==============N e w P o s t i n g  (1)=============
From:Kathy Welch
Subject:New to internet

Hi Everyone,

I am new to the internet and have the opportunity to start a
safelist.There are lots of safelist out there so I would like some
constructive thoughts on how I could make my safelist a little different.

I'm trying to find out some of the needs of the internet marketer that
would draw them to a particular safelist.

Thanks for your input.

Kathy Welch

Living Life to its Fullest!


==============N e w P o s t i n g  (2)=============
From:Claire Solt

I would like to comment on the statement that the easiest way to track
responses is to send them to different email addresses.

In my opinion, tracking your ads is a very important thing to learn, and
the sooner one learns it the better. I use Adtrackz which only costs
$37.50 one time. Every ad I place goes through this tracker and is then
referred on. I can see at a glance all of the clicks on my ads from every

In the first place, ad tracking helps one debug ad campaigns. In other
words it clues you to links that are not working, so you can correct the
typos that send your ads off somewhere in cyberspace instead of going
where you intend.

I track everything. Email ads, traffic exchanges, link submissions, etc.
That is the only way to know whether certain advertising is cost effective
or worth my time.

There are a couple of free adtrackers. Some of my affiliates are using a
free tracker called Hypertracker. You can also test an ad free and get
statistics by posting it at Then advertise
it to get the traffic you need. Less than 1000 hits is too small of a

To see adtrackz, here is my tracking link:

However, this is one area where you should not skimp. Track your ads, test
them, and tweak them to get the best response rate possible.

Claire Solt

Knowledge Is Power Learn Online Marketing NOW
Granny is a Marketing and Training Pro Learn
to Get 900 Hits/day Systematically CLICK NOW


=====================Site Review Request  (1)===============
From:William Nabaza

site review pls.




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=====================Site Review Response  (1)===============
From:John Olson


Wow, You have put in so much work on this site haven't you? And with all
the work and thought, why oh why, do you have it hosted on a Free Site?

This is your first mistake. You are asking people to trust you with their
future income.  You are telling people that you have all this experience
and knowledge, but you host on a Free site. Don't you see the problem

A FREE Site. And you expect people to trust that you know what you are

Now, I am not saying you don't have a good idea here. I am not saying you
can't make it work. What I am saying is as a first impression, you Blew

I don't doubt you are an accomplished salesperson, the copy on the site is
all pointed to making a sale, getting someone to ask you to help them.

But here are something's I don't think you knew you were also selling.

You sold me on the idea that you rushed this and didn't proof it, even in
Canada the word, "opportunity" is not spelled "opertunity" I don't think.

You sold me on the fact that you don't know much about the Trellix Builder
you are using with this Free site. You see, when you pick a template with
Trellix, they fill in the spaces where text could be placed with, "Enter
content here." And, "Enter supporting content here." And for an E-mail
link they have, ""

Found all these little helps from Trellix still on your site. You sold me
on the fact that this site is not ready to be seen.

And one think to keep in mind as you rebuild this starter site, when you
have a link that says, "More Info" and it's on the same page several times
under different headings, it is not good to have all of them go to the
same E-mail address, and a one at that. Oh, just found your
Hotmail one on another page.

And try and find some photos that don't have, "Photos to Go" on them. That
is cheap looking, at least when they are that large and you are trying to
impress us with all you know about marketing, sales and business.

Tim, you Sold me. You sold me that right now as far as an online business
is concerned, you don't know much.

But the biggest mistake is not having a domain name, and hosting for free.

Good luck, and get back to work.

John Olson

It's Your Money. It's Your Time.



=====================Site Review Response  (2)===============
From:Tom Falco

Hi Tim,

You asked how you can make your website grow and
really work. The first step is to get a real URL name.

A free tripod account will turn off most people interested
in doing business. Also, it is hard to sell and market.
Imagine being at a holiday party this time of year and
someone asks for your website info. Try telling your
current URL to them three times fast.

Tom Falco
Order Wedding invitations on line...

=====================Joke of the Day   (1)===============

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in this case?"

"No sir, your honor, sir," replied Amanpreet, "I've got a lawyer
to do the defendin'. I'm the person who done it."

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