A Free subscribed Discussion List
                          of 25,000 subscribers
                  on web marketing and promotion
            supported by AdlandPro World's Classifieds
                      Bogdan Fiedur, Publisher
                                 contact at
                 Vol. 1 issue #332 Feb, 12, 2003

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C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n s (8)
1. What Are You Doing As An Ezine Publisher?
~Jennie Forrister
~Cheryl A. Crossan

2. Email Marketing (Harvesting of email addresses)
~John Jones
~Gary Kidd

3. Internet Business Club
~Laurence Lowne

4. Never ever pay again for website promotion
~Robert Lee
~John Olson
~Cathy Wagner
~Andy Sparks

5. Mis- leading information
~Amalia Sotiriadou
~Pauline Phillips
~Gary Kidd
~Cheryl A. Crossan
~Cathy Wagner

6. GMT
~John Olson
~John Olson

7. Getting Web Buyers
~Robert Lee
~Cathy Wagner
~Amalia Sotiriadou

8. So many programs, so little time
~Amalia Sotiriadou

N e w P o s t s (10)
1. I am not getting the Newsletter
~John Olson

2. Greatest Links To Make Money Using The Net And The Mail

3. Threats to the Online Marketer
~Tammie Allen

4. Are you making all the money you are worth?
~Randy Chaffin

5. How do YOU send out group mail?
~Glen McDonald

6. New Payment System
~Christian Ionica

~Robert Lee

8. Text versus HTML Ezines

9. The New American Gold Rush
~Robert L. Bufkin

10. What's Your Take on ClickBank Malls?
~Lewis Leake

Site Review Requests (0)
No review requests this week

Site Review Responses (6)
~John Olson

~Robert Lee
~John Olson

~John Olson

~John Olson

~John Olson

~John Olson

G u e s t A r t i c l e (0)

Joke of the Day

================== Word from publisher ====================

Greetings All

Welcome 480 new subscribers who joined list since last mailing.

I am putting together this issue for Bogdan, so if your Post is in the wrong place
or the layout is slightly different - my fault!

Bogdan, sadly is at the funeral for his Dad.
I am sure that all Digest Subscribers join with me in expressing our condolences
to Bogdan and his family.

Doug Appleby.

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===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.1)=============
From: Jennie Forrister
Subject:What Are You Doing As An Ezine Publisher?


This is the first time I've responded to these messages but I found the
one quoted below interesting and gave it a try. As of yet I haven't gotten
any responce. How long does it usually take and what should I be looking
for exactly?


J Forrister
Publisher - The Home Office Press Business News

"From:Natalie Bodrova.
Subject:What Are You Doing As An Ezine Publisher?
1. Send your ezine to the following email address:

2. In the SUBJECT line of the email put exactly what you
would normally put, but at the very beginning, type the
word "TEST" without the quotes)."

J Forrister
Publisher - The Home Office Press Business News

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (1.2)=============
From: Cheryl A. Crossan
Subject:What Are You Doing As An Ezine Publisher?

I was doing like most people until Habeas came along, then I woke up I
realixed they were just an insideous part of an overall problem. So this
is my new plan. I have told my subs, all 600 of them :o), if they want my
ezine, they are going to have to get an email that is not an run by an ISP
who supports Habeas. I do not intend to give in to the demands of this
Mini Mafia. I don't want subs, I want readers. I have changed the way I
handle new co-op sub ads. I used to think it was wrong to hold them
"hostage" but now they need to receive the first copy of my classified
before their ad is run. If it doesn't get through thrie filter, then their
ad doesn't get run. So, since they pay good money to have these ads run,
it is in their best interest to give me a non filtered address. I have
quit trying to take out filtered words. I give my subs free things all the
time, and I'm not going to put asteriks on that word anymore in order to
tell them things have been added to my resource page. I am also calling
them subscribers again, and I'm adding back the "send heres" to make it
easier for them. It's really a very simple plan. If people don't use ISPs
that filter, they will lose money. ISPs are all ABOUT money. So, they
won't use filters. So, there will be no need for habeas. Don't get me
wrong, I think filtered email is fine at the REQUEST of the user, it's
only when the ISP makes an arbitrary decision to filter that it becomes
intrusive. I don't need someone telling me what to read, I can use my
delete button and expect my subs can too. If I never get another sub, I
really don't care because I already have the greatest group in the world.
This is about CHOICES and publishers better wake up and fight while they
still have some choices or none of us are going to be in business.
Sincerely, Cheryl.
Cheryl A. Crossan is the publisher of netSteals news, helping you design,
host, find marketing partners and andvertise your site for little or no
cost. Mailto:cheryl@netstealsnews

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (2.1)=============
From: John Jones
Subject: Email Marketing (Harvesting of email addresses)

I have to congratulate Van C Johnson on a most enlightening contribution
to this discussion.

How is one to sow a seed without permission?

If I meet someone in the street who is a stranger is it an arrestable
offence to approach him/her and say "Good day, I would like to offer you
an enhancement to your future wellbeing"? If it is, nthen every Jehovahs
Witness would be in Jail, as would every politician at the hustings.

As for the Internet, I NEVER send out information about ANY opportunity, I
send people a free gift, if they reply and ask for it fine, if they don't
that's ok too.

John Jones
Does losing all your Emails and Contact addresses each time your system
crashes annoy you? I bet it does and some. Well here is the solution.
Absolutely FREE with no further obligation:

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (2.2)=============
From: Gary Kidd
Subject: Email Marketing (Harvesting of email addresses)

Response to Cathy Wagner's reply.

If you had actually read my message, you would of seen that I said to
write with a legitimate business proposal. That is not SPAM, no matter
what you think.

I also said if you write to them with simply an Ad, then that is SPAM.

I publish an Ezine and without some of the legitimate proposal's I get
each day, it would take me much longer to find some real good products.

With all due respect Cathy, firstly, you should find out what SPAM is, and
secondly, you should find out what a legimate business proposal is.

Lastly, you should read some things twice to make sure you understand what
is being written!


Gary J Kidd
Amazing New Free Report Reveals All

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (3.1)=============
From: Laurence Lowne
Subject: Internet Business Club

Andy Sparks wrote about his idea for an Internet Business Club.

In principle I have absolutely no problem with the idea, but isn't that
what we have here with Bogdan?

And very useful I find it too, even though probably 95% of subscribers are
US based and poor old me is in the minority being on the other side of the
pond in the UK.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not looking to belittle your idea, since I
feel there are many merits to such a scheme.

The danger is diluting what we already have with Bogdan and that must be a
consideration before launching.

You are looking at it from the point of view of providing a service in
exchange for a small fee. Forums and advice centres rarely work that way
on the internet.

Providing software such as ezine builders and autoresponders again is OK,
but the danger is you get caught up in the online scams such as GMT and
have your website and name tarnished. Someone somewhere will take
advantage and ruin it for the majority.

Access fee - hmmm, very difficult.

Would need online conversion facility for other currencies - so perhaps $3
or $5 per month (2 or 3.50 per month in my currency), or better still an
annual payment where you could set up a range of magazine subscriptions at
say a 70% discount as an incentive to join - have a look at this site and click the banner on the front page to
see the UK magazine discount offers.

I am sure there are similar with Time-Warner in the US.

Overall I am not against a one-stop solution providing the balance is
right and that it is not pitched against this forum, which I find


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electricity, stomping great deals on landline and mobile telephony - new
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===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (4.1)=============
From: Robert Lee
Subject: Never ever pay again for website promotion

I juts have to comment about what Elizabeth Piotrowski said about starting
your website on a shoestring budget, or with no $$ at all.
Elizabeth, you have contradicted yourself quite a bit in the last digest.
You start off by saying that newbies don't have to have their own domain
name, that free hosting is ok to start... then you proceeded to tell us
how you tried to HIDE the fact that you had no domain name, that your
hosting was free.

QUOTE: In my opinion, the 'very basic requirement for success' isn't a
paid web site account or domain name - it comes from within. If you truly
believe you can be successful and you work toward that goal, everything
will fall into place.
End Quote

Elizabeth, how many geocities web sites are there that you've seen? How
many would you trust your money too? Despite the fact that they have a
piad hosting option, they, along with most other free and sub-domain free
services, have a lot of untrustworthy sites hosted.

Your little story (Quote): Let me tell you a little story about how I
started out online. I created my first website with Netscape Composer.
However, it wasn't long before I became curious about what was going on
'behind the scenes' of a webpage, so I taught myself how to read and write
HTML. I signed up for a free 5mb hosting account at Linkopp
( It took a while, but eventually I was able to
purchase a domain name. However, I was still unable to pay for hosting, so
I had my domain name redirected through Zone Edit
( This free service was truly a godsend. Shortly
thereafter, paid hosting became a reality for me.End Quote
Just goes to tell us that if you have a few dollars to pay for a real
domain name and a few more to pay for hosting you probably would have been
ahead of the game by months if not years.

QUOTE: Online success IS possible, even if you don't have 2 pennies to rub
together in the beginning. I am living proof :)
End Quote

Yes, the success is there, it can be accomplished. Shouldn't the newbie be
introduced to tools that work, even if they are just a few dollars? And
isn't having your own domain name and web site the first steps in a
professional appearance?

I bet that your Google success did not happen until you had your own
domain name.

Domain names on sale! The cheapest anywhere for 1 year registrations!
$5.95 for .US $5.95 for .BIZ
Only $8.75 for .COM!
Robert Lee

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (4.2)=============
From: John Olson
Subject: Never ever pay again for website promotion


Sorry I didn't reply to your post in #330. I never received it. Had to go
to the Archives to find it.

I find we are in agreement again.

I agree people should build there own sites. Sites where they control the
content and what programs are pushed. Anyone who really wants to make
money online should have their own Website, their own To not have
one almost makes sure they will be never get anywhere, marketing anything.

But the problem is that People are lazy. They want it all done for them.
Look at all the Free to joins running around the Web, telling people they
don't have to spend a Dime and they will still make money. That's Garbage.
Even the few Free to joins out there, Paid to Reads and the like, will
Cost You Time and a Lot of Work building a downline so you can earn more
then a few pennies.

Look at all the "We Build Your Downline For You" type junk out there.

Why are there so many and why is someone getting Rich by starting and
marketing them? Because they are praying on peoples Laziness. People don't
want to do the work. So they believe this junk and join, spending money
they think will come back to them, even if they do nothing. Guess what,
they loose 99.99999% of the time.

I do maintain that Hit Exchanges can work, if you are using the right kind
of page in them. Most programs don't offer that. So, having your own site,
lets you make the right kind of page. Short simple, with just enough
information to get someone interested enough to request more information
through your autoresponder. And then you have them on a mailing list and
you are on your way.

As for Search Engine placement and writing a good page. Well, I can write
and so can you. But a lot of people can't. I hear from them all the time.
I have a large list I mail to every week, and I see this kind of thing in
the replies they send me. They don't know how to write, ad copy or
autoresponder messages, let alone write good copy for a Website.

But that is where Adland comes in and helps out. Anyone who is working on
a site and wants help, can ask for a review and get it. So, there is help
out there, even message boards where someone can request a site review and
get some ideas and help.

But how many are really serious about their so called business?

I guess between you and me and the rest of the Adland posters, we will
have to help them get serious.

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (4.3)=============
From: Cathy Wagner
Subject: Never ever pay again for website promotion

Here, Here Elizabeth!

Thank you for sharing your story with us. My own story is very similar to yours.

Beginners, and even some who have been working at this for a while, really need to exercise patience and determination. Every profitable business, on or off line, takes time to build; we are very lucky to live in a time where we can make something out of nothing but our own desire, effort and will.

Have a Profitable Day,

Cathy Wagner
ONE STOP Internet Business Services
If you can get it for FREE, we'll show you where!
If you HAVE to pay, use our recommendations to
get the MOST for your money!

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (4.4)=============
From: Andy Sparks
Subject: Never ever pay again for website promotion

Hi Elizabeth,

It is possible to walk from one coast of the USA to the other without
paying for transportation. If you count your time as having any value it
is cheaper, easier and more efficient to go and pick up $69 worth of
aluminum cans to sell and ride the dog (Greyhound Bus)to the opposite

I take the opposite point of view and believe it is a disservice to the
newbie to allow them to believe they can be succussful using only free
resources. It is possible but you are going to wear out a lot of shoes,
just like walking from coast to coast, it doesn't cost anything but it is
more expensive than it looks.

I noticed from your post that while you started with free services, it
didn't take you long to upgrade. I and I hope the Newbies reading this
can only assume that you upgraded to improve your results.

In a lot of ways your "attack" (which by the way was quite pleasant and
doesn't hurt my feelings in any way)reinforces my point. Why do we
(because I used to tell people they could succeed without spending any
money) set people up for disapointment when they don't achieve success?
We told them it was possible, we just didn't tell them how much more
difficult it is to succeed.

I believe that if a Newbie really understood the amount of work and
frustration involved with using most "free" resources, they would go out
and pick up enough aluminum cans to pay for hosting and a domain.

Adlandpro is the only free ad site that I have ever been succesful using.
I get better results from a free ad on Adland pro Classifieds than I do
from paid ads.

Here is my point, yes, it is possible to build a business using free
resources, but it is highly unlikely that you will succeed with only free

While there are a million reasons for having your own domain here are two
very solid examples from my personal experience.

When I started out, I was introduced to a company called One World Online
it was an Internet MLM company and I was a true believer. I paid $1,200
or $1,500 to be a member of their organization and attended meetings,
advertized "my" web site and spent lots of money on Internet promotion and
newspaper ads. All I received for that effort and expenditure was $25.00
and a DVD player. That was one expensive DVD player.

I had been promoting a page on their web site. They went busted and the
site went down. All my work, traffic, advertising and effort was gone. I
was dead in the water but a little wiser.

Here is the second example. Not being the sharpest crayon in the box, when
Going Platinum arrives on the scene, I jump onboard with both feet. Only
this time, I make some pages on my site talking about Going Platinum and I
buy some extra ad impressions on Adlandpro and talk about Going Platinum
here in the Digest. I do some other things that I have learned that don't
cost much and have some results. I get quite a feww members in my
downline and some actually upgrade but I never seem to get paid.

Anyway when Going Platinum never really got anywhere, I just changed the
pages on my site to link to another company or product and I never missed
a step. My site was still up, my ads were still good and all my incoming
links are still coming in.

I don't know how many times people have posted to the Digest wanting to
know what happened to XYZ free hosting? All my pages are gone and I can't
find them!

If you are going to promote a web site and build traffic, build your own
and not someone else's site and traffic. Build your own traffic and refer
your traffic to other sites for compensation. If they stop compensating,
just switch them out and keep on building your traffic and improving your
Andy Sparks
I never made a dime until I took this advice.


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.1)=============
From: Amalia Sotiriadou
Subject: Mis- leading information

Several posts on the same subject today. Not too surprising considering
the large number of people who have either "tried and lost" or are still
trying and not able to make a "go" of their online business. Someone can
keep going, spending money and counting on trial and error and a bit of
luck to get them there, I suppose, but that is silly, considering how many
"help" sites there exist to guide you out of the "spend and lose" cycle.
As long as it's a legit help site, of course, and not just another
advertising trick to make you part with your money.
Let me cut through the BS right off the bat and get to the heart of the
matter. There are only TWO ways you can make money on the net.

1. Own your own MLM program
2. Have, or create your own opt-in list.

Preferably both.

Neither one of these ways are rocket science, anyone can do them,
especially #2. It doesn't take thousands of dollars either. You can find a
programmer to build you a matrix for $200-$500. For the larger amount
he/she will throw in the site design.
Don't know the first thing about matrices? No problem. Join a program that
looks like it's going somewhere and work on building your opt-in list
insteaad. All you need is a simple HTML page linked to an autoresponder.
If you can make the HTML page yourself, and get a free autoresponder,
total cost is $0. Offer a little course on something you know about, a
series of jokes, some news, an ebook, ANYTHING in exchange for a person's
email and name and you are on your way to building your own opt-in list.
Work on gaining the trust of your subscribers by helping instead of just
using them as guinea pigs for your ads, build a relationship. A good
number is bound to become your customers.
I realize that this is not the fast track to riches and it may take aome
time before people will trust you enough to invest their hard earned money
in your opp, but it's the only sure way of getting there.
The Internet is a fantastic medium making distances and locations
irrelevant, giving you the opportunity to market to the world, but keep in
mind that it is still ONLY a medium. Just because the medium is fast
doesn't mean that people make fast decisions. People have not changed,
only the medium has. Give the same consideration to the person on the
other side of your super-fast connection that you would give a real-life
customer visiting your real-life business and you will do just fine.

Amalia Sotiriadou

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.2)=============
From: Seqkat
Subject: Mis- leading information

Hey Bill,

I began falling for businesses that were misleading in year 2000.
I joined an affiliate program that made it look all too easy to make
money online - at the cost of $30.00 per month to me. Guess who
made money? Yep, the affiliate owner. They claimed they'd provide
training - but there was none of that, only a discussion board.

By 2001 I had had enough of that - and started my own business.
You can read my success story here if you like:

My advice to you - don't let the BS - as you refer to it, get you down
and win. Beat the game, by starting your own honest business. How
do you that?

Think about everything you dislike in the businesses that have left
a bad taste in your mouth. List all those bad things. Then look and
see how you can start a business that offers the very opposites of
them. You are far from alone in being sick of being lied to. You
are among 1000's - hundred 1000's. There's a market waiting for
your solution. Cash in on it. Think this over - and see if you can't
come up with something.

When the light bulb comes on, then start an ezine that will empower
your business, and be your communication to reach an audience
with your cause and your business. You'd be amazed at how affordable
doing your own thing is. I spend $60.00 a month, running my own

How do you start that ezine? Take my free ezine training course. It
teaches you how to start one, and how to obtain and retain subscribers.
It also teaches you how to sell ads for revenue, you can implement
that too, or just implement the formulas, to sell whatever services you
came up with for your business:

I know you can do this, Bill - for you have the passion for it! True
success comes from passion, for from that passion comes determination,
and tenacity - the needed characteristics for success!

When you do start this business, be sure to let us Adlanders know! I
know I'd love to see what you've started!! Hope this gets you going!

Best of success to you, Bill and God bless!
In His Joy,
Seqkat >^..^<
"He (Jesus) sent two of His disciples, saying,
'Go ye into the Village'..." Luke 19:29-30

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.3)=============
From: Pauline Phillips
Subject: Mis- leading information


Yes there is. Go to and check out virtually any website
you want. It provides ranking, traffic, comparison with other websites,
addresses, phone #s, etc. virrtually anything you need to know. If the info
is sparse for a give site of the type you have in mind, you can take that
into account.

Alexa is now an firm. So it has to be good for to have
bought it. It's also recommended by, whose Site Build It I use
for my website. As an associate, I have an Alexa ranking graphic
on my homepage at . My ranking isn't as good
as I'd like, but it's much better than most!

Pauline Phillips

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.4)=============
From: Gary Kidd
Subject: Mis- leading information

Regarding Bill Murphy's message.

Oh boy! If it is any consolation Bill, you are not alone. Nearly 95% of
people in this business fail to make a profit, and most of those lose the
same sums of money that you have.

You can find the top 12 scams at this site

But remember, this is the opinion of some people and not everyone.
Nevertheless some good advice is given here.

Use your search engine to find some other places to check businesses.

My advice? You need to go back to basics. Get your own website,
concentrate on building your list. That is where you will find the road to
success. Beware, it takes time, effort, a little money but above all
dedication. Be consistent and persistent.

Most offline businesses make a three year plan to be in profit, so why
should an online business be any different.

My three years are up and I am in profit, but only because I never gave up
and was willing to do what was needed.

If you are not willing to do what is needed, then my advice would be to
get out now, and find something else.

I offer a Free report for people who want to know simplest way to make
money online. is where you can
get it.

With regards to the programs you are with, are there people in these
programs making money? How long have they been there? Do you use the
product? Do you believe in what you are doing? Are you expecting others to
build your business for you?

Analyse yourself first to see if the problem may lie there. If you are
happy with your attitude, find a program or product you believe in. Then
build your list and promote your product to your list.

Good luck.
Gary Kidd


===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.5)=============
From: Cheryl A. Crossan
Subject: Mis- leading information

I too am on SDD, and I started my own ezine and website for less than
$90.00 which I state on my site, and I cab help you do the same thing. I
started my ezine, NetSteals News for people just like you because I was
convinced it was possibe to make money on the internet without spending
your hard earned money on scams. If you go to I can
help you, but it takes work and persistance. You are NOT going to make
$10,000 while you sleep at the beach. But, I've gone from nothing to about
$200.00 a month in a few month and the figure goes up a little every
month. It's a nice supplement to my SSD right now which will someday
replace it I hope. Sincerely, Cheryl
NetSteals News, helping you design, host, find marketing partners, and
advertise your site for little or no cost.

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (5.6)=============
From: Cathy Wagner
Subject: Mis- leading information

Hi Bill,

I soo understand how you feel! I was there myself, with my first online opportunity that seemed like a steal at $30 per month. They told me all I had to do was promote it and the money would come rolling in.

I didn't have $4000. to lose or I probably would have; I decided to use all the free tools I could. I did a lot of research and began building a site especially for people like you and me, who have more drive and desire than money.

Two years later it is an excellent resource filled with more free information, tips and recomendations than other other single site. http://

This is not just a "sign up, pay your money and good luck" kind of site; this is interactive. I host live marketing discussions twice a month and I actively invite member's to contact me if they have any questions or comments.

This level of service is not just reserved for Paid Members; Free Members are entitled to the same benefits and even non-members can attend chats and read my articles which have been published on a variety of content sites and newletters.

So, before you throw in the towel, check it out for free. Meet some other marketers who know exactly how you feel and find out how they overcome frustration in my favorite chat room. You will find some new resolve and learn something, too. :)

Have a Profitable Day,

Cathy Wagner
ONE STOP Internet Business Services
Your ONE STOP for high quality marketing
information, tips and recommendations

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (6.1)=============
From: John Olson
Subject: GMT

Sorry I didn't reply to your post in #330. I never received it. Had to go
to the Archives to find it.

I am sorry that I might have flown off the handle with my replies to both
you and Robert Lee in Adland #329. But it seemed to me that the way both
of you replied, made it sound like I thought GMT was an okay program. And
making me sound like some kind of fool who should not be listened to.

That made me more then a little Mad. Sorry I took it out on you.

As for my comment on Robert Lee being anti MLM, I have to say, that is the
tone he presents almost every time he writes about an MLM program. Do I
really have to go back in the Adland Archives for examples?

And I don't totally trash someone for building a Free site on Tripod,
unless it's a bad site. Though I will always tell them they should get a
paid host with a real domain name. And if you reread what I think you are
referring to, you will see that Robert Lee made the comment about a site
being hosted for free on Tripod, and I replied that the site was not a
Tripod site and wondered what he has against them as a host.

This is what I wrote in a separate post to Robert,


In your review of this site, You stated:

>Serious Tools for the Serious Marketer. Really? Then why is your site a
tripod hosted site? <

Maybe I missed something, but I didn't see anything on this site that
tells me it is hosted on Tripod. I just checked the source code, and there
is no mention of Tripod. Also this is a Real domain name, not a Tripod

And there is nothing wrong with hosting on Tripod, they do offer paid
hosting just like my host or yours.>>

Please William, if you are going to blast me, make sure you have fully
read what you are blasting me for.

As for my comment about CCI, I was over the top with that, just to make a
point. I guess I made it. And as for this comment from you:

<I take it that you only read the money making part before making a
judgement. Now That is really outrageous.>

I advice anyone to NEVER Join something just for the MONEY. Read this
piece on my Marketing Course Site:

I will admit to have joined more then my share of programs for reasons
like that, but I have learn a thing or two over the years. Never Join just
for the Money someone tells you, you can make. NEVER...

And, let's not get into another discussion about GP.
John Olson

It's Your Money. It's Your Time.

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (6.1)=============
From: John Olson
Subject: GMT


Sorry I didn't reply to your post in #330. I never received it. Had to go
to the Archives to find it.

Gee, I am glad you and your in-law are making some money in this little
scheme. I will quote a little from your fearless leader on one of his
information calls that someone asked me to listen to. Well, I can't quote
it exactly, but I am sure you will remember the figures, the basic deal
was that it takes One Thousand people signing up and paying their $199 for
a little more then Four Hundred to get checks.

It would seem to me, silly old country bumpkin that I am, that it's not
going to be to long before it becomes harder and harder to find another
One Thousand People to pay $199 so less then half that amount can get a
check. And what will happen when those people stop getting the checks that
the Website and the Program Promised them they would get....?

I can assure you that the meetings I talked about are being held. People
are joining and paying Hundreds, not for the product, they don't have any
idea why they need it, they are only joining for the Promise of easy Cash.
And as for Amway and the rest doing the same thing, I am not saying that
they are scams too, but how many people who join and pay money in those
meetings are making money? Not many, but at least they know they need the

I will tell you what I don't like about GMT. I don't like a program that
tells people all they have to do is Pay XXX amount and they WILL receive
XXXXXX amount more. I don't like a program that tells people they don't
have to do a thing and they will get Rich. GMT promises this, or at least
that is the impression people get from reading their offer.

I wish you luck. I hope you make a Ton before GMT is closed down or falls.
Will it be next month, next year? I don't know. But I could not promote
something that I am sure will go down, as I am sure GMT will... at some

Yes, some will say that all or most MLM's will fall at some point. But
most of them are not so blatantly heading down that path as GMT is. A
program cannot Promise someone will earn XXX and not deliver on that
promise. What will happen when the time comes that GMT can't deliver? Who
and how many will be out how much money?

Take care,
John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (7.1)=============
From: Robert Lee
Subject: Getting Web Buyers

Goerge Martin asks: While I've been in Business for over 13 years, I am
just now trying to market my Products and Services across the Internet.
I've been trying all sorts of Solo-Ads, Traffic Generators, Ezines and
FFA's and I don't believe that I'm getting much in the way of "hits" let
alone actual Customers. What are my Best and most cost efficient ways for
me to Market my WebSite to actual consumers?

George, as you must know, most businesses that are successful start and
sell local. The same is true for Internet businesses. Concerning your own
website you should use it as an add-on to your brick and mortar business,
not as a separate entity altogether. Have your sales reps explain the
convenience of using your website to your existing customers and watch the
usage grow from there.
It can take anywhere from 6 months to many years to move your customers to
online purchasing, depending on their mindset, but by having your sales
reps introduce the website at every opportunity you will watch it grow.

One marketing suggestion I have for you would be the smaller newspapers in
your business area, see if you can get an interview about your business
and how you are turning it into an online adventure as well as your brick
and mortar store.

Your site can be very much "solutions orientated", I'd steer it that way.
For instance, you offer online technical support that is paid for through
PayPal. But you are short on what the $15.00 involves. If it is just a
deposit for a service call, if it is for carry-in or home service, or
phone support. You need more details on that page.
Then sell the sizzle.

Domain names on sale! The cheapest anywhere for 1 year registrations!
$5.95 for .US $5.95 for .BIZ
Only $8.75 for .COM!
Robert Lee

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (7.2)=============
From: Cathy Wagner
Subject: Getting Web Buyers

I looked at your site, nice! I also looked at your marketingkit site, it looks like a lot of return email for you.

Your target market with the on site service seems rather narrow. If I were you, I would not put up with a lot of return mail in the hope that some of your messages went to people in your area.

I suggest a much more direct approach would be to try a regional chat room or maybe a Philadelphia forum, where you can talk directly to people in your area.

Best of all would be to get web sites with a local Philadelphia or Cape Hatteras theme (not a tourist site) to let you put your link on their page. Perhaps you could offer them some space on your web site in trade, or maybe they would just like to be able to recommend your service on their page.

You might have more luck selling your hard drives and video cards to the masses online, but that is not mentioned on your Welcome page. I think it would also help to have prices and shipping information on your products page.

Have a Profitable Day,

Cathy Wagner
ONE STOP Internet Business Services
Featuring the best of every marketing technique.
We've got tools you've NEVER even HEARD of!

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (7.3)=============
From: Seqkat
Subject: Getting Web Buyers

Hey George,

I know how hard it is to market online - it's a whole new ball game from
the offline world.

FFA's are history - they result more in you getting swamped with return
ads - and there are so many auto submissions, that most places you post -
are never visited, and thus are never read.

Solo Ads can be your BEST type of ezine advertising or the very opposite -
the WORST.

The only effective Solo Ad is one bearing a contest offering prizes to
contestants who either read your ad, or even better view your site.

How can Solo Ads be the worst type of ezine advertising? If one is
subscribed to many ezines, as many are, if there is no incentive for the
reader to read the ad - they'll delete it,seeing it as yet another ad.
Also, if one publisher sends out too many ads, the same thing happens.
Search for places that offer incentives for readers to read your ad and/or
visit your site.

Yes, I offer those ads to my subscriber base of 9000.

Also, the easiest way to sell something is to sell to the customer exactly
what they want or need. How can you conform your offer to be just that?
Simple - ask them.

I also have Business Review Solo Ads, where my subscriber base visits your
site and looks at your offer thoroughly, and as a potential customer. And
then they provide you feedback, answering questions to a form to tell you
what they liked, or thought needed improving on your offer, presentation,
pricing and so forth. You can see the questions they answer here:

For a thorough lesson on how to Advertise Effectively online visit my free
web training page here: - the training
page is complete with resources as well.

George, I hope this helps! To your success, God bless!
In His Joy,
Seqkat >^..^<
"He (Jesus) sent two of His disciples, saying,
'Go ye into the Village'..." Luke 19:29-30

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (7.4)=============
From: Amalia Sotiriadou
Subject: Getting Web Buyers

Sorry if I seem to be monopolising this issue today, but I can't resist
responding to all these questions!
George, your site is all about ways to bring in hits and customers... I am
wondering, are you using this tool (I could only access 1 - The Marketing
Kit)yourself, or are you just trying to resell it? And if it isn't working
for YOU to bring you hits and customers why on earth are you trying to
sell it to others?
Just wondering what YOUR reasoning is, because I know that you CAN make
most of these tools work for you to a certain extent with the right

Amalia Sotiriadou

===========C o n t i n u i n g D i s c u s s i o n (8.1)=============
From: Amalia Sotiriadou
Subject: So many programs, so little time

I realize what you are showing us it not what your site will eventually
be, since you are planning to launch on March 1st, but if this site is
indicative of your final work it seems to me that you still have a long
way to go in order to serve everything you promise in your intro page.
A general comment: You have many, many pages with only one or two
paragraphs in each and I kept having to click on still another link to get
to where I was hoping to get some info. Why is that? How many links will a
person keep following before they get tires of clicking one more link? To
be frank, I got bored after the 5th or 6th.
I checked your leading opps and found only 2... in which I suppose you are
an affiliate. Your tools included only 6 safelists one of which is your
own. There is no advice, no explanations, nothing but the links.
Generally, it looks to me as simply a place where you are showing what you
are involved in personally and it doesn't even come close to the
expectations you build in your intro. I suggest you work a lot more at it.
Amalia Sotiriadou

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==============N e w P o s t i n g (1)=============
From:John Olson
Subject: I am not getting the Newsletter

For some reason, I am not getting every issue of the
News Letter. I just got #331, but saw no Replies from
me in it. So, I went to the Archives and found #330.

I found that I had never received it. There were my
replies and my site Reviews. And some messages Replying
to things I had written in #329.

Do you know of a reason why I am not getting some of
the News Letters? This is the second time I have missed
a issue.

I keep my eye out for your News Letters everyday. I
doubt I could have deleted it by accident.

John Olson

==============N e w P o s t i n g (2)=============
Subject: Greatest Links To Make Money Using The Net And The Mail

great business opportunity for making money while surfing the net and
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that make the cash flow - try it out. Other Great Stuff,Casino, Cool
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==============N e w P o s t i n g (3)=============
From:Tammie Allen
Subject: Threats to the Online Marketer

I have worked in customer service for years. When a customer acted like a
jerk, being an employee, my only option was to try to remain calm and pass
the really bad ones off to my boss.

Today I am the boss. Where does the online marketer draw the line between
protecting their business from the damage a dissatisfied customer can do
with email, and not having to bite our tongues until they bleed?

Because of the ease with which email can be used to pass on information, I
worry about the damage someone can do, whether they are justified or not
(this person definately isn't). If email messages are saved to back up a
person's claim, can defamation of character be threatened with conviction?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I already let this person ruin my
day. I refuse to let him ruin my business!

Thank you,

Tammie Allen
Webmaster for The-Net-Review & AFA Solo Ad Coop

==============N e w P o s t i n g (4)=============
From:Randy Chaffin
Subject: Are you making all the money you are worth?

No! Then visit my website for details on how you could be making a
residual 6 figure income within 2-3 years.
Randy Chaffin

==============N e w P o s t i n g (5)=============
From: Glen McDonald
Subject: How do YOU send out group mail?

Hi all,

I have been receiving the Adland Digest for some time and must confess
that most of the time I don't have the time to read it all (my bad) as I'm
sure that the answer to my question has probably already been discussed.
The internet however is constantly evolving and there may be others out
there that would like to hear your solutions to my problem.

I run a couple of different sites and one of the problems that I have
found over and over again is host that will not allow you to send out
group mail.

I have tried a number of different "group mail" programs that work just
fine, but not all ISP's will allow their use. In some cases the ports
that are required are even blocked.

Because many sites these days use a mysql (or like) database to store
their member/subscriber information it nice to be able to run a script
that will insert information into your emails to make them more
personable. I have a small script I use on my sites that send out mail in
small blocks (to avoid server script run time restrictions), but still
some hosts will not allow it.

Question 1.. HOW do you send out your CUSTOMIZED group mailings?

Please keep in mind when answering this that COST is a very important

Thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge.

Glen McDonald
AMCS Web Services.

==============N e w P o s t i n g (6)=============
From: Christian Ionica
Subject: New Payment System

Hi Bogdan and fellow Adlanders,

I've come across a new payment system which is similar
to PayPal but MUCH better.

Why is much better? Because...

- it's accepted in ALL countries (you know this is a big problem)
- they will not freese your account for no reason

Of course, it's fr** to join and they also have a very good
compensation plan, 6 levels deep.

Compensation Plan:
Level Commission (based on StormPay's Percentage)

1 2.50%
2 2.50%
3 2.50%
4 2.50%
5 2.50%
6 2.50%

With Paypal ceasing support of all M*L*M and many
affiliate programs on the net, everyone that needs to
pay for their programs and receive their commissions
have been caught searching for alternatives.

Stormpay has been one that has developed to be one of
the fastest and most dependable methods.

The big news released Feb 1st is their affiliate
program. Now you're getting paid commissions 6
levels deep on all downline members.

There are 20 million Paypal users; how many of them
will in the next few months be forced to send and
receive their payments from another source?

Here's a tip: If the program you are paying now doesn't
have Stormpay yet, get your Stormpay account and contact
them today. They will be grateful you did and you will
have alot of members in that program paying you
commissions (including the Webmaster himself).

I thought Adland members should know about this.
They can sign up and tell their friend about it too.
This will benefit everyone because of the compensation plan.

You should take a look and sign up too, Bogdan... :o)

Here's the link:

Only the best to all of you!

Cristian Ionica

NEW State-of-the-Art Technology for YOUR Business!
You'll have the ability to call anywhere in the WORLD
for FR** ... only if you check the website below...

==============N e w P o s t i n g (7)=============
From:Robert Lee

If you are on any spam lists concerning the online dating industry, you've
no doubt received an email from I have looked into
their website and program and found it to be full of air.
Please, until you have seen any response from them posted to my site, do
not link to this site. They promise nothing and ask for a lot, is my
opinion. I have emailed them to clarify what exactly they do but have yet
to receive a reply.
Robert Lee

==============N e w P o s t i n g (8)=============
Subject: Text versus HTML Ezines

If you publish an ezine do you do so in text format or HTML? and why?
Also, if you publish in HTML what program or programs do you use to create
your ezine? As a subscriber what format do you prefer your ezines to be
"Freebies for Webmasters"


==============N e w P o s t i n g (9)=============
From: Robert L. Bufkin
Subject: The New American Gold Rush

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them. Nothing else like it on the web.
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==============N e w P o s t i n g (10)=============
From: Lewis Leake
Subject: What's Your Take on ClickBank Malls?

ClickBank malls seem to be cropping up everywhere. Will they be
successful? How would you go about marketing a CB mall? What are the
thoughts of the Adland Digest subscribers?
Subscribe to GrowNetProfits Newsletter - get 3 New Traffic Generating

=====================Site Review Request (0)===============
No review requests this week

=====================Site Reviews (6)===============
~John Olson


Seems I never noticed that the site was hosted on Tripod when Sharon
originally asked for a review.

I generally do check the source code, but I only look for Meta Tags to see
if they are there and what they are. I don't really care where a site is
hosted, unless it is on a free site with all the banners, pop ups and
stuff that Screams Free Hosted Site. This site was certainly not hosted
for free on Tripod. Having just read what Sharon wrote about moving the
site to a new host, I now know why when I went back and checked the source
code again before replying to you, I did not see Tripod on it.

But as I said and Sharon said, Tripod does offer paid hosting. And she was
using it. Her site was not hosted on Tripod for free. If it was, I would
have mentioned it too. There is nothing wrong with paying Tripod to host a
site. Just because they offer some hosting plans for free, doesn't make
their paid hosting worthless.

And you are right, we do review sites differently. I think it gives the
person requesting a review more to work from, having different points of
view on the same site. I can't do what you can do with the technical parts
of a site, but I can do what I do with the over all impression of the site
from a visitors point of view. I think we both give the person requesting
help some good advice. Just from different points of view.

Looking forward to more of your reviews.

John Olson

It's Your Money. It's Your Time.
~Robert Lee

Site review for: why
is there no index page at ??
Is this simply a "copy-and-paste" web site? Yes, it is. Thanks for wasting
my time with unoriginal content and plenty of affiliate links.
Links on this page: are not properly
formatted (in the ICQ box).
Navigation is uneven and hidden in white top text and incomplete sidebar
menu. Pick one form of navigation and stick with it.
On your progress page:
Be sure to post when you've given up the MLM madness, or at leats post
some of the checks when you start getting near your earnings goal.
I'm quite interested to know if you make it.
Domain names on sale! The cheapest anywhere for 1 year registrations!
$5.95 for .US $5.95 for .BIZ
Only $8.75 for .COM!
Robert Lee

~John Olson

On first seeing your site and from the URL, I thought it was an affiliate
site, but when I really looked at it, I realized that it was not.

Over all a very nice site. Clean and fast loading. You tell us who you are
and what you are all about. That's good. I know you say on the site that
all the links are not working quite yet, do get them up or take what
appears to be a link off.

I like the lay out of the page, except for the "MLM is the Best" page. The
copy on this page goes on and on and with the narrow text, it seems
strange, sort of. Is there a way you can open the text up after the
navigation box so it runs most of the way to the left?

Also, you might want to reread your text. I noticed some places where a
coma would seem to be in order, and some of the phrasing seems a bit off
to my ear.

The site you are building for your friend looks very nice as well, though
it makes me wonder if you aren't using some kind of predesigned kind of
hosting company. But maybe it's just your style.

You definitely have the right idea here, by having your own site to market
from. I wish you lots of luck with it. And keep reaching for those Goals
of yours.

Take care,

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.
~John Olson

Well, this is a site I wouldn't normally visit. Most of the site looks
just fine, but you have a problem, at least with my browser, IE 6.0. On
the Home page you have an area labeled, "Womens Health Corner" with some
yellow text that is supposed to be in the blue box under the heading. When
I view it, the yellow text is way off to the left with hardly any of it in
the blue box.

Also on several pages you have this sliding .gif for "The Natural Breast
Enhancement Program" that sides up and down with the page. It covers some
of the text to the right of it and needs to be moved left. Also, it's

And one more thing, the way you have the Home page laid out, I don't know
where to start reading. Do I start with the text nearest the top or the
text on the lower left. If I were you, I would do something about this.
Your visitor should be hit with what you want most for them to read when
the page first loads. I would not want them guessing.

Good luck

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.
~John Olson

Sorry I couldn't review your site in Adland #331, never got Adland #330.

A quick look at the Home page tells me
2 things, you are using my favorite online Builder from Trellix through
you host, Bizland, and that you have Way to many Banners on it.

And after looking over more pages I can see you have the same problem on a
lot of them. I understand what you are doing with the banners on the
recipe pages and it's not a bad idea, get someone thinking about food and
there is a site that they can go to and get some food. If you are going to
do this, then get smaller banners from Link Share or CJ. Also, you might
want to not have so many on each page, you want them to load fast and a
lot of banners will slow things down.

So, on the recipe pages I would cut the number and the sizes of the

Now as for the Mall pages, you need to do something with these. If you
decide to keep the Mall part of the site, then you have to make it easier
for people to find what they are looking for. Having pages labeled the way
you do does nothing to help me find a place to buy a DVD for example. I
mean how many of those slow loading pages with all those banners do I have
to go through to find some place to get my favorite DVD?

If you look at my site, built with a Trellix Builder from another host,
you will see that I have done something like you have, but in the shopping
part of the site, I have divided it into categories so people have an
easier time finding something. That could be the reason your Mall has not
generated much profit. Something to think about.

Also you might want to create a page labeled "Site Map" or "Site
Directory" then list what is on each page with a link to it. That would
help too.

Also, your domain name while great for Biz Opts, does nothing for you when
it comes to people who want to buy something or get a good recipe.

Also, you have different back grounds for the two different parts of the
site. I don't know how to get around this because you really have 2
different sites under one domain, biz opts and recipes. Three if you count
the Mall.

Here is my thought, buy yourself a second domain for the recipe part of
the site, and redirect it to that site. You might even create a new site
just like the recipe part you have now and use the new domain just for
that site, with links to the other site.Then delete the old recipe pages,
but add a link to that new site.

Your bizoppchoices does not do you any good for the shopper or the cook.

Also, you need to place a second set of navigation links on the bottom of
each page. If you are using the same version of the builder I am, you can
do this on the "Footer," the lowest place on a page you can add things to.
It will be carried over to every page on the site. In that way you can
create links to all the pages once and never have to worry about it until
you add or remove a page.

You really need to divide the site, into at least two sites. This is easy
to do with your builder. But will require some long nights on your part,
recreating the old pages. Right now, 4% of it is Biz opts, 6% Mall and the
other 90% is recipes. Not a good mix for a site with a domain name,

Good luck,

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.

~John Olson

I am glad to see you on the Web with this, but you are going to half to do
a better job. The site as you say loads very slowly because of all the
pictures. You should find a way to create other pages so you can spread
them out.

Sorry to say but this site really looks home made. Not very proffessional
at all.

There is nothing on the Home page that tells me what to expect. Nice Chuck
Wagon, but it's not centered in the Rope Frame. You need some text telling
us what this site is all about. What are we doing on it? Why would we want
to even visit it, let alone check the other Massively Slow loading pages

You really need to do a complete rethink on the whole site. Take a look at
some other sites that offer something close to what you are offering and
see what they have done.

I wish you luck, but this site needs some real help. Also, you should get
your own domain name for it, unless you are the owner of
which seems like a directory of places in some state, the name of which I
can only guess.

Good luck,

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.
~John Olson

Great looking site. Very proffessional, clean and full of information. The
only thing I would do is add a link to the Home page on the top naviagtion
bar. Other then that, you have done a nice job.

Good luck,

John Olson
It's Your Money. It's Your Time.

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